I’m curious, I’m going to visit family soon and I’m going to face the annual “We need to save you from hell” talk. Maybe I can get them to stop and think about their beliefs?
Post any links, or anything below, of odd, impossible things the bible claims to have happened (Such as God flooding…
Tell your family that the most ridiculous thing in the Bible is the statement that God is Love! Your proof that God is an unloving monster is easy and simple. Here is the argument you use.
God is said in the Bible to love his creation ‘like a father loves his son’. However the Bible also says this same loving god created Heaven and Hell and free will and told his ‘children’ to choose between them on where to spend their eternal futures. This exposes each one of his so very loved children to the risk that they use their free will and choose Hell and suffer eternally. This is not evidence of love.
No father who loves his child and had the power of Creation of this Bible God, would DELIBERATELY CREATE a place like Hell and tell his child he has the freedom to choose it if he so wishes to go there. Every father who loves his children strives his utmost to protect them from pain and torture and will NEVER DESIGN a 50% chance for his child to suffer FOREVER and EVER in a HELL. This is not evidence of the love of a father, for I would never do this to my children and I am just a human. I expect so much more from a God I should worship!
This therefore means that the written words of the Bible do not match the concepts those words are trying to describe. The words say God is Love…the choice this God gives his children is MONSTROUS and will result in many of his children suffering eternally. This shows the Bible is NOT from any LOVING God and is therefore untrue, and is the creation of lesser humans who lacked the intelligence to understand this problem of choices versus being loving, they were creating when they made their claims about this Bible God.
The Devil Satan was once a very happy angel, created by God, in Heaven, long before Hell was brought into existence, by Satan becoming greedy for power in heaven and acquiring the desire to take it over from God.
Use the Socratic method of putting forward an argument with a question to your family for this discussion! Ask them this question!
How is it at all possible for anyone who is present and abiding in that most perfect place, like Heaven is supposed to be, to become greedy, envious, dissatisfied with the status quo, unhappy, disgruntled, power-hungry and any other adjective you may want to use to describe Satan’s feelings when he rebelled in Heaven?
If Satan had the free will in Heaven to choose to move from being a contented, happy, blissful angel, singing in choral symphony to God in heaven, to an army-raising, war-mongering, Hell-destined horror of a demon, then the rest of all souls also present in Heaven can also have the same free will to choose to go to Hell. This makes us the human race vey likely to end up in the majority in Hell, for we are already a rebellious, disobedient, spirited species. This loving God has apparently weighted the dice in favour of us humans ending up in Hell. Tell them not to be so sure they will spend eternity in Heaven once they get there, for once there, in Heaven, it appears you still retain your free will to choose to stay there and sing to God, or complain about the place and get kicked out into Hell.
Tell your family that such a DESIGN does not attract you to believe in such a God as it reeks of cruelty!
Hope you have a peaceful and enjoyable visit to your family, filled with debate, verbal thrust and counter-thrust!
It is ridiculous to believe that there is such thing as a third heaven or a hell.
It is ridiculous to believe that god or jesus is coming back after all this time knowing that he said he come back quickly which over 2000 years later is not quit
The bible says really nothing to do with our times except for some mention of earthquakes which is a natural thing that happens sometimes.
It is just ridiculous to believe the bible today but many still do because their ears and minds are shut tight.
Sorry, you will not be able to get them to stop and think about their beliefs. Don’t waste the effort. But if you can’t resist, most Christians have to really stretch their faith to accept the Jesus Zombie Apocalypse:
51 At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split 52 and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. 53 They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and went into the holy city and appeared to many people.
Interesting in itself, but beyond that you would think there would be some account of this amazing event in some extra-Bubblical source. None.
Frankly it doesn’t matter how good your argument is. The likelihood you’ll actually make them challenge their beliefs is pretty much nil.
For what its worth, try Iron Chariots wiki for arguments and counter-rebuttals.
Okay.You can say why Jesus is a rehash or sun gods in many religions,ancient and current.
Ask them if they think the bible upholds stealing or the practice of magic to accumulate wealth? Then ask them if God would choose a man that stole from his father-in-law for several years, then snuck away in the nite to avoid detection, as a man to bless all of mankind? Of course their answer should be NO,
Now grab one of their bibles on the coffee table and turn to Genesis 30.
Laban who is Jacob’s (of the famous Abraham, Isaac, Jacob) father in law asks his son-in-law what he could give him for his new family. Just read what Jacob does to steal animals from his father in law.
31 “What shall I give you?” he asked.
“Don’t give me anything,” Jacob replied. “But if you will do this one thing for me, I will go on tending your flocks and watching over them: 32 Let me go through all your flocks today and remove from them every speckled or spotted sheep, every dark-colored lamb and every spotted or speckled goat. They will be my wages. 33 And my honesty will testify for me in the future, whenever you check on the wages you have paid me. Any goat in my possession that is not speckled or spotted, or any lamb that is not dark-colored, will be considered stolen.”
34 “Agreed,” said Laban. “Let it be as you have said.” 35 That same day he removed all the male goats that were streaked or spotted, and all the speckled or spotted female goats (all that had white on them) and all the dark-colored lambs, and he placed them in the care of his sons. 36 Then he put a three-day journey between himself and Jacob, while Jacob continued to tend the rest of Laban’s flocks.
37 Jacob, however, took fresh-cut branches from poplar, almond and plane trees and made white stripes on them by peeling the bark and exposing the white inner wood of the branches. 38 Then he placed the peeled branches in all the watering troughs, so that they would be directly in front of the flocks when they came to drink. When the flocks were in heat and came to drink, 39 they mated in front of the branches. And they bore young that were streaked or speckled or spotted. 40 Jacob set apart the young of the flock by themselves, but made the rest face the streaked and dark-colored animals that belonged to Laban. Thus he made separate flocks for himself and did not put them with Laban’s animals. 41 Whenever the stronger females were in heat, Jacob would place the branches in the troughs in front of the animals so they would mate near the branches, 42 but if the animals were weak, he would not place them there. So the weak animals went to Laban and the strong ones to Jacob. 43 In this way the man grew exceedingly prosperous and came to own large flocks, and female and male servants, and camels and donkeys.
Jacob uses magic, then chooses only the best animals from the flock for himself, and then in the next chapter or two steals away with all his loot……This man is the man God chose to bless all of mankind through his seed.
christians are wack jobs ask them why so many tens of thousands of them let themselves and their children be burned beaten and ripped apart by nero rather than deny they saw christ ascend into heaven!? that one always gets them!
For your family: You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink.
For you: You are rebellious. I’ll give you a break and not finish my thought.
Cant wait to see some of these answers, should be really good.
The sun will turn black and the moon will turn to blood. I always thought the moon would turn to cheese.